Another Greek Tragedy?

[The Kop]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-headed_eagle

Double-headed eagle = association with Byzantine Empire (Holy Roman Empire), one head looks East one West.

AEK Athens = Athletic Union of Constantinople (capital of Byzantine Empire) Athens
PAOK = Pan-Thessalonian Athletic Club of Constantinople

Both clubs formed by migrants from Constantinople in mid 1920s after exchange of populations in 1922.

[God is an Englishman]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-headed_eagle

Double-headed eagle = association with Byzantine Empire (Holy Roman Empire), one head looks East one West.

AEK Athens = Athletic Union of Constantinople (capital of Byzantine Empire) Athens
PAOK = Pan-Thessalonian Athletic Club of Constantinople

Both clubs formed by migrants from Constantinople in mid 1920s after exchange of populations in 1922.

so, they're turkish clubs then!

Is this why so many of the guys at raptors support these two.

[The Kop]

That the best bait you've got?

[God is an Englishman]

That the best bait you've got?

:?

all 3 clubs named after places in turkey. Just made an assumption, that's all. I feel sorry for umption if i got it wrong.

[The Kop]

Kill 20minutes of your time reading about Constantinople and the exchange of populations and your confusion should erode..

[God is an Englishman]

Kill 20minutes of your time reading about Constantinople and the exchange of populations and your confusion should erode..

I am aware of the many different populations and "empires" that called constantinople home but is it not (officially since the 1930's) known as istanbul - the largest city in turkey. I think it's quite fair to call it a turkish city.

[The Kop]

Kill 20minutes of your time reading about Constantinople and the exchange of populations and your confusion should erode..

I am aware of the many different populations and "empires" that called constantinople home but is it not (officially since the 1930's) known as istanbul - the largest city in turkey. I think it's quite fair to call it a turkish city.

You see this is better bait.

Turkey was not made an autonomous republic until 1923. The exchange of populations occurred a year earlier. So it wouldn't be at all accurate to call it a Turkish city then.

Even in it's current name, it still refers to Constantinople. Es tin poli.

[God is an Englishman]

Kill 20minutes of your time reading about Constantinople and the exchange of populations and your confusion should erode..

I am aware of the many different populations and "empires" that called constantinople home but is it not (officially since the 1930's) known as istanbul - the largest city in turkey. I think it's quite fair to call it a turkish city.

You see this is better bait.

Turkey was not made an autonomous republic until 1923. The exchange of populations occurred a year earlier. So it wouldn't be at all accurate to call it a Turkish city then.

Even in it's current name, it still refers to Constantinople. Es tin poli.

I presume 1923 is when Attaturk came into power.

Constantinope was called Istanbul well before the official name change. However, the land mass it occupies is in turkey.


So the land that is constantinople and Imbros, is in turkey.

A bit like Delhi is still an indian city, sydney - australian and Londonium - English.

[The Kop]

Land mass is clearly beside the point.
Turkey didn't exist as a nation until 1923. So when 2.5m Greeks from Istanbul and Anatolia moved West to modern day Greece in 1922 how could they be coming from Turkey or be Turkish.


Even the Turkish name refers the Byzantinium:
Istanbul = eis tin poli (in the city)
Constantinople = known simple as tin poli (the city)

[God is an Englishman]

Land mass is clearly beside the point.
Turkey didn't exist as a nation until 1923. So when 2.5m Greeks from Istanbul and Anatolia moved West to modern day Greece in 1922 how could they be coming from Turkey or be Turkish.


Even the Turkish name refers the Byzantinium:
Istanbul = eis tin poli (in the city)
Constantinople = known simple as tin poli (the city)

You can't move from somewhere that isn't there, but surely you are not denying that istanbul used to be constantinople and surely you are not denying that istanbul is a turkish city.


So I presume you are also amongst the ranks that accepts that Aelxandra wasn't greek then.

[Stitch This]

I need to sit down and think about all this.

Ottoman anyone?

[The Kop]

Land mass is clearly beside the point.
Turkey didn't exist as a nation until 1923. So when 2.5m Greeks from Istanbul and Anatolia moved West to modern day Greece in 1922 how could they be coming from Turkey or be Turkish.


Even the Turkish name refers the Byzantinium:
Istanbul = eis tin poli (in the city)
Constantinople = known simple as tin poli (the city)

You can't move from somewhere that isn't there, but surely you are not denying that istanbul used to be constantinople and surely you are not denying that istanbul is a turkish city.


So I presume you are also amongst the ranks that accepts that Aelxandra wasn't greek then.

I agree you can't move from somewhere that isn't there.
Byzantinium, Constantinople and Istanbul are all the same cities, that is correct.

I'm not denying that it's a city in the Turkish Republic now and was as of 1923 onwards. But prior to that, and in the year where migrants were exchanged whom went on to form the clubs AEK, PAOK and Panionios it couldn't have been a Turkish city as Turkey didn't exist. So then how can these clubs be Turkish?


Stich this is on the right track....

[God is an Englishman]

Land mass is clearly beside the point.
Turkey didn't exist as a nation until 1923. So when 2.5m Greeks from Istanbul and Anatolia moved West to modern day Greece in 1922 how could they be coming from Turkey or be Turkish.


Even the Turkish name refers the Byzantinium:
Istanbul = eis tin poli (in the city)
Constantinople = known simple as tin poli (the city)

You can't move from somewhere that isn't there, but surely you are not denying that istanbul used to be constantinople and surely you are not denying that istanbul is a turkish city.


So I presume you are also amongst the ranks that accepts that Aelxandra wasn't greek then.

I agree you can't move from somewhere that isn't there.
Byzantinium, Constantinople and Istanbul are all the same cities, that is correct.

I'm not denying that it's a city in the Turkish Republic now and was as of 1923 onwards. But prior to that, and in the year where migrants were exchanged whom went on to form the clubs AEK, PAOK and Panionios it couldn't have been a Turkish city as Turkey didn't exist. So then how can these clubs be Turkish?


Stich this is on the right track....

So, if we can agree that constantinople is now istanbul and that istanbul is a turkish city. The point must still be raised that a club named after a turkish city must have heritage from what is now turkey and by default a Turkish club.

Whilst they play in greece or australia, the heritage is turkish.

[The Kop]

Your timelines are off. How can you retrospectively apply the nationality of a migrant from a country that didn't exist when they migrated.

[God is an Englishman]

Your timelines are off. How can you retrospectively apply the nationality of a migrant from a country that didn't exist when they migrated.

If England changed it's name to God's Country, would I be entitled to a passport from England or God's country?

I migrated before the country "God's Country" even existed but I would still be a citizen of that country.

[The Kop]

Asteras reinstated...lol you couldnt begin to make this up

[COLOSSUS]

So I presume you are also amongst the ranks that accepts that Aelxandra wasn't greek then.

Alexandra possibly not though every chance she was whoever she is but ALEXANDER better known as ALEXANDROS was most definitely a HELLENE of that there is no doubt or else he would of been called ALEXANDROVSKI if he were from Vardaska

[God is an Englishman]

So I presume you are also amongst the ranks that accepts that Aelxandra wasn't greek then.

Alexandra possibly not though every chance she was whoever she is but ALEXANDER better known as ALEXANDROS was most definitely a HELLENE of that there is no doubt or else he would of been called ALEXANDROVSKI if he were from Vardaska

I asked if he was greek, not if he was helen. So, the King of macdonia wasn't from macedonia? :?

You're a big one for blood lines, so how can the son of a macedonian, not be macedonian?
Oh and I would also sugges he was better known as alexander nor alexandros. I mean who's even heard of alexandros the great but everyone's heard of alexander the great and the macedonian empire.

[Željko Jurin]

So I presume you are also amongst the ranks that accepts that Aelxandra wasn't greek then.

Alexandra possibly not though every chance she was whoever she is but ALEXANDER better known as ALEXANDROS was most definitely a HELLENE of that there is no doubt or else he would of been called ALEXANDROVSKI if he were from Vardaska

I asked if he was greek, not if he was helen. So, the King of macdonia wasn't from macedonia? :?
You're a big one for blood lines, so how can the son of a macedonian, not be macedonian?
Oh and I would also sugges he was better known as alexander nor alexandros. I mean who's even heard of alexandros the great but everyone's heard of alexander the great and the macedonian empire.

Which one is related to #17 in the Caufield Cup ?

[COLOSSUS]

So I presume you are also amongst the ranks that accepts that Aelxandra wasn't greek then.

Alexandra possibly not though every chance she was whoever she is but ALEXANDER better known as ALEXANDROS was most definitely a HELLENE of that there is no doubt or else he would of been called ALEXANDROVSKI if he were from Vardaska

I asked if he was greek, not if he was helen. So, the King of macdonia wasn't from macedonia? :?

You're a big one for blood lines, so how can the son of a macedonian, not be macedonian?
Oh and I would also sugges he was better known as alexander nor alexandros. I mean who's even heard of alexandros the great but everyone's heard of alexander the great and the macedonian empire.

Oh dear, EPIC FAIL

Might have to start charging you for these FACTUAL history lessons

ALEXANDROS O MEGAS (translation: Alexander the Great) or O MEGAS ALEXANDROS (translation: the Great Alexander) as he was known was born the child of his Mother OLYMPIAS of Epirus and of his Father PHILIPOS of Macedonia with both parents coming from HELLENIC kingdoms of Ancient Greece. ALEXANDROS O MEGAS was born in Pella, Macedonia which lies in the Greek peninsula which was and still is a part of Greece today. The word Macedonia comes from the Ancient Greek word "Makednos" which means a "tall one" and "highlander" describing the people.

NOWHERE in antiquity and NOWHERE on any artifacts or in any
Ancient texts (and there are many) have inscriptions been found to suggest his name (ALEXANDROS) was spelt as to then be pronounced as ALEXANDER or ALEKSANDER or even ALEXANDROVSKI. To put it simply, ALEXANDER is the translation used in English to spell and pronounce his GREEK name which is unarguably found on every inscription and in every text in Antiquity. Furthermore, your suggestion that everyone has heard of "Alexander the Great" is absolutely FALSE and distortion of historical FACT when you consider the time of Alexanders birth which is circa 3rd century BC and the modern day 21st century AD where there is nearly 2500 years of time lapsed and the English language as the worlds "commonly" used one today is in all fairness an insignificant fraction of those years. In 2500 years, possibly your statement may have some truth to it though it will never detract from the facts which are, he was born ALEXANDROS and died ALEXANDROS and was known as ALEXANDROS O MEGAS or O MEGAS ALEXANDROS and that his name or the one attached to it to honor his achievements pronounced in ANY other language other than Ancient or Modern Greek (which have the same spelling) are nothing more than translations used for the people it is translated for to understand

Hope you learnt something now I accept MasterCard, Visa or cash, which one will you be using???

[COLOSSUS]

Which one is related to #17 in the Caufield Cup ?

not sure but please refer to the people that named the horse

[cubby]

Looks like Croatia playing the greek rellies in the play-off

[COLOSSUS]

Looks like Croatia playing the greek rellies in the play-off

Now that's some quality bait right there yaga but I haven't got the energy to take your rusty hook

[God is an Englishman]

What has historical fact got to do with people knowing alexander the great, bearing in mind more people don't speak greek than those that do it would stand to reason that more people would know the translated name. You are forgetting that most people are stupid and probably base their knowledge on him from Colin Farrell.

So, you are greek because you have greek parentage but alexander isn't macedonian despite his macedonian parentage. :?

You really need to explain to me how someone with a macedonian father, isn't macedonian.

[BlackBrian_7]

That the best bait you've got?

:?

all 3 clubs named after places in turkey. Just made an assumption, that's all. I feel sorry for umption if i got it wrong.

I thought it was an albanian thing....

[God is an Englishman]

That the best bait you've got?

:?

all 3 clubs named after places in turkey. Just made an assumption, that's all. I feel sorry for umption if i got it wrong.

I thought it was an albanian thing....

well as far as I know Imbros and Constantinople are turkish, not albanian.

[BlackBrian_7]

I meant the double headed eagle thing.

[Željko Jurin]

I always thought anything with a double head is Tasmanian ....

[COLOSSUS]

What has historical fact got to do with people knowing alexander the great, bearing in mind more people don't speak greek than those that do it would stand to reason that more people would know the translated name. You are forgetting that most people are stupid and probably base their knowledge on him from Colin Farrell.

So, you are greek because you have greek parentage but alexander isn't macedonian despite his macedonian parentage. :?

You really need to explain to me how someone with a macedonian father, isn't macedonian.

Again Hawkesy, there has been 2500 years approx pass since his birth. In the time Alexander walked the earth, Greek was the lingo of the day and was spoken much through the Roman, Byzantian and Ottoman empires long after ALEXANDROS had passed. only until English became the universal language did the term ALEXANDER THE GREAT become the translated term used. Having said that, you again assume that most people associate with Colin Farrell when talking about Alexander. What utter crap, Colin Farrell isn't spoken about at school, that we can be assured of

On your point of his ethnicity, well that's as easy as explaining a Londoner as English, a Parisian as French or a Neapolitan as an Italian though the latter could be debated
The facts are, his father a Greek of Macedonian stock and his mother a Greek of Epirian stock is no different to me as a Greek of Rodian stock on both my parents side or a Croatian like Zeljks whose father may be of Vukovar stock and his mother of (generally speaking) of Dubrovnik stock, it's a no brainer really

[COLOSSUS]

:?

all 3 clubs named after places in turkey. Just made an assumption, that's all. I feel sorry for umption if i got it wrong.

I thought it was an albanian thing....

well as far as I know Imbros and Constantinople are turkish, not albanian.

Imbros is not Turkish much like Constantinople isn't, however, both lie now on what is undisputed Ancient Greek lands much like do some other neighboring countries to Greece. Turks even pay respect to that fact with the name of their biggest city Istanbul being a Greek name