Suggestions for improvement of refereeing standards.

[Wraith]

We have a ref's room at our ground.

Some ref's use it - others don;t worry about it.

[robinfriday10]

Would the formation of a Players' Rep. Group/ Committee be a good idea to liaise with the League and the Ref's on a regular basis?

now your talkin.....good idea

[beancounter]

Maybe the starting pointis to use some money that we (SAASL)have to commission a professional body or persons to survey all existing, retired or resigned refs etc. as to what their thoughts are and what it is that motivates them to take up the job or quit. Their brief could be to survey all stakeholders and to produce an independent report with recommendations and a clearly defined plan to increase and retain the numbers and the overall quality and standard of refereeing. It will take some time and dough but this is what the AFL (thru Bill Sanders did.

Any report would be useful to FFA amateurs and Junior associations for the good of the game so maybe they can all be invited to chip in and pay for it.

[God is an Englishman]

quite simple really, start progression of refs due to their abilities and not just how long they've been mates with the secretary.

[emirates01]

talk to ffsa refs and ask them what would it take for you to ref an amateur game, or more importantly why would you not ref an amateur game.i think you would find that a big reason why they wouldnt would be the lack of security.i watched the downs vs farm game where there was a lot of harsh criticism from both sets of supporters towards the ref which also led to some idiot throwing a beer bottle at one of the farm players.this game had a young linesman,so i wonder what he thought. secutity, money and the league backing the refs in sending offs deffinately major issues.

[blind_spot]

I think for reserve the pay should be 50 to 100 dollars ....
Seniors refs should get around 150+ dollars a game ....
But the standars has to improve ..there is no point in the referee gettiing more money but the same quality..they need to start training ref more than once a week.... i mean most refs in the amateur league are too slow and that will affect their calls...some cant see the play or others just call wateva they want .. i mean how can u call a penalty from the halfway line...thats just ridiculous...

[Reverberation]

others just call wateva they want ..

I very much doubt that, especially if you're referring to official referees. What you see isn't necessarily what they see.

[blind_spot]

others just call wateva they want ..

I very much doubt that, especially if you're referring to official referees. What you see isn't necessarily what they see.

OOOOOps What I mean is that they sometime call things that aren;t necesarilly there mostly because they too far from the action...

[kinghenrik]

Our loss on the weekend had nothing to do with the ref Robbo. I started on about ref standards the week before at the Florina game which we won. Not intersested in

excuses just interested in improving the quality and numbers. if I had wanted to say anything I would have mentioned the three clear hand balls, three clear penalties not given, the free kicks given to players while they played the ball while they were on the ground! The elbow, i spoke to one of your supporters at half time and he said he couldnt believe the ref missed it, the overruling of throws ins given by the linesman in a much better position to see. The rugby tackle laid on Mark Kelly only to be rewarded with a free kick to the tackler. The fact is I hadnt mentioned any of that Robbo. Hey and we got away with some stuff too. I also didnt mention that I was told a linesman and the ref are associated with Ingle Farm by way of family members playing for the club, yes its a worry but good clubs get on with the job and dont let small stuff override the big picture. I also note that you were on the BBQ most of the game and didnt see much. So no I never mentioned any of that, I could have but I didnt.

Only interested in moving on and getting some suggestions as to how we as a collective group go about improving the competition we all love and want to see grow and prosper. Sitting on hands wont get us anywhere. So if you dont have a suggestion then dont comment on what my motives are.

im not sure but that there is a clear motive to me.i swear you downs boys must play these games with halos around your heads. as i said in another topic, there was no elbow, the farm player never raised his arm but merely followed through and actually made no contact. your defender made an absolute meal of it. now we're talking about refs being family members and 763 free kicks that were not called for ya. so if your saying that none of that was the reason the downs lost, are you telling us all that you were just plain shite then?? im sorry but i do not recall reading these downs initiated topics repeatedly through the season. only after you guys had a close but sore defeat. you had all the credibility in the world until you gave us the novel about how hard done to you were.

[God is an Englishman]

talk to ffsa refs and ask them what would it take for you to ref an amateur game, or more importantly why would you not ref an amateur game.i think you would find that a big reason why they wouldnt would be the lack of security.i watched the downs vs farm game where there was a lot of harsh criticism from both sets of supporters towards the ref which also led to some idiot throwing a beer bottle at one of the farm players.this game had a young linesman,so i wonder what he thought. secutity, money and the league backing the refs in sending offs deffinately major issues.

GOOD POINT!

Recently there has been 3 incidents involving clubs and the security involved.

Salisbury Villa apparently trying to attack the ref.
Bullets player performing a flying drop kick on ref
Downs supporter throwing a bottle on the pitch

[Neville Bartos]

How do you do a flying drop kick?

[legga]

How come no one has mentioned when the ingle farm reserves coach ran onto the pitch when there was a bit of a scuffle in the a,s. So would you say that was a security breach as well towards a ref you biffs..Give the Refs what they deserve they chose to be sub standard and if they do not have the balls to stamp their authority on a game of football see ya later losers. That goes for you as well Leo you dirty dog of a ref from Florina margarines. Legga to ref the return leg at the downs...

[marooned]

The wee tim calling himself king enrik wrote

now we're talking about refs being family members and 763 free kicks that were not called for ya. so if your saying that none of that was the reason the downs lost, are you telling us all that you were just plain shite then?? im sorry but i do not recall reading these downs initiated topics repeatedly through the season. only after you guys had a close but sore defeat. you had all the credibility in the world until you gave us the novel about how hard done to you were.

Yes Enrik you seem to be the only person turning this into a blame someone thread. Go back and check what i said about the ref after we beat Florina. Gave you 9 in a row of clowns. A little check of previous statements would stop you writing things that undermine your credibility.

[Jay Walking]

What ref has a relation at Ingle Farm??

Rob Lozza was a player there a few years ago but thats about the only connection I know of.

[Rob Lozza]

What ref has a relation at Ingle Farm??

Rob Lozza was a player there a few years ago but thats about the only connection I know of.

Yep - for the second half of 1999 after I got brought back from "semi-retirement" by Cappy - very enjoyable.

[Jay Walking]

As for improving standards, I dont think its all about money. I do think a higher fee would be an incentive but you would have to pay me much more than $300 to cop the abuse levelled at refs at some games.

I think training is a big thing. Players train 2-3 times a week, how often to refs go to referee training, not just for fitness but for knowledge of the laws and how to act and deal with situations.

Security is still an issue and as much as we want to think there isn't a problem there is. Its easy to be a hero with team mates and supporters around you if something happens on the park. As a ref, your on your own.

I think we all need to play apart in it. Supporters, coaches, players and committees. We tolerate yelling abuse at the referee and sometimes when we start a bit of agro but we can control ourselves, we wind up others who can't control their agression. I'm still yet to see an offical referee who cheats in a game. They have no reason to. I have seen the ref influenced by supporters going to far with comments made towards them. We have done a good job stamping out racial comments, maybe we need to tone down what we say to a ref.

The reality is, its rare we will agree with the ref when he gives something against us. We all think he is wrong and the opposition thinks he is right.

I like the idea of a group meeting with refs to discuss issues and ideas also.

[Jay Walking]

What ref has a relation at Ingle Farm??

Rob Lozza was a player there a few years ago but thats about the only connection I know of.

Yep - for the second half of 1999 after I got brought back from "semi-retirement" by Cappy - very enjoyable.

Its still stuff of legend at the club

[Rob Lozza]

What ref has a relation at Ingle Farm??

Rob Lozza was a player there a few years ago but thats about the only connection I know of.

Yep - for the second half of 1999 after I got brought back from "semi-retirement" by Cappy - very enjoyable.

Its still stuff of legend at the club

Ha ha - I doubt that but thanks. I did nearly jag the B&F for the C's - I think Gerry won it. Missed out by one or two votes.

[emirates01]

this is a great topic brought up by marooned which is aimed at improving the standards of refereeing, so what happens now?. will the chairmen of all clubs get together and approach the league with suggestions? will all the coaches do the same?. who will get the ball rolling?. i know there are a lot of questions to be asked and perhaps marooned is just this man. well done on this topic, and great to see that some one is worried about the way things are going and are prepared to voice there concern.

[marooned]

Bill and Alex have been invited to the game this week and I will voice concerns and will push for a meeting with all that want to be involved including the refs asso. to rectify and start to improve the quality. My aim on this forum is to get as much feedback from all involved. Some things suggested were the same things raised 10-15 years ago, some suggestions have merit. But been there done that, time for a different tact is what i believe. Forget the numbers game lets get in the quality and that I do believe is the answer. Just because were amatuers does not mean we cant implement proffesional approaches to our game. keep the suggestions coming. From little things big things grow.

[MUMPHY]

I'm more than happy to bring up the subject at our next referees monthly meeting.One things for sure something needs to be done.Regular meetings between refs and club officials will highlight concerns in our game.I think clubs should make more effort at discipline of players also.Too many watch rooney on telly tell the ref to f *** off and think its the ok thing to do. Few weeks back i booked 4 players for dissent after comments made and it was felt I had a poor game.Being the anal stat man i am I checked out that this particular club had been reffed 6 times by me in the last 2 or 3 years.After checking previous team sheets I worked out that i had booked 8 players in those 6 games for dissent.What was more interesting is that all 8 cards were after they had gone behind by a goal or 2.Now me being proactive I'd like to go up to their coach and tell him my findings in the hope that he appreciates and then addresses it with his players as i'd feel thats useful info?Yes?"Look guys if we go down by a goal keep ya heads" sort a thing?I think that sort of open discussion should be ok......what dya think?....it would only take one daft coach though to turn round and say"oh i get it ref you're targeting my players are ya".......no win situation.....I'm still going to approach him i think?

[gunner_59]

...... Just because were amatuers does not mean we cant implement proffesional approaches to our game. keep the suggestions coming. From little things big things grow.

I know name changes should be treated with caution but don't you think the title of our competition is now outdated? The term amateur may have been appropriate 40 years ago to give that distinction between paid and unpaid athletes but I don't think the term has relevance anymore. Both the SAASL and SAASRA maybe should think about this. Both bodies have structures and policies in place that look at continually trying to raise standards.
Around the time of establishment of the Amateur League, the Olympic committee was changing its stance on professional athletes participating in the Games. There is now no distinction between amateur and professional in the Olympic arena.
I'll try not to off topic too much but it's just that I am sick of hearing the comment "Amateurs, what do you expect!" from people when they criticize players, clubs or officials in our competition. Like someone said earlier in this thread, the grass is not any greener in the supposed professional competition.

[kinghenrik]

The wee tim calling himself king enrik wrote

now we're talking about refs being family members and 763 free kicks that were not called for ya. so if your saying that none of that was the reason the downs lost, are you telling us all that you were just plain shite then?? im sorry but i do not recall reading these downs initiated topics repeatedly through the season. only after you guys had a close but sore defeat. you had all the credibility in the world until you gave us the novel about how hard done to you were.

Yes Enrik you seem to be the only person turning this into a blame someone thread. Go back and check what i said about the ref after we beat Florina. Gave you 9 in a row of clowns. A little check of previous statements would stop you writing things that undermine your credibility.

take it easy, take it easy, gosh you downs fellas really are a bit narky atm i like the 9 in a row jibe. that was a great achievement for you guys(im assuming your a teddy bear) to emulate the celtic team of the 60's who done it first. yes marooned i do agree that more money and training would certainly help but i certainly don't think that our game is on the verge of soccermaggedden due to the refs standards.

[East Boy]

I'm more than happy to bring up the subject at our next referees monthly meeting.One things for sure something needs to be done.Regular meetings between refs and club officials will highlight concerns in our game.I think clubs should make more effort at discipline of players also.Too many watch rooney on telly tell the ref to f *** off and think its the ok thing to do. Few weeks back i booked 4 players for dissent after comments made and it was felt I had a poor game.Being the anal stat man i am I checked out that this particular club had been reffed 6 times by me in the last 2 or 3 years.After checking previous team sheets I worked out that i had booked 8 players in those 6 games for dissent.What was more interesting is that all 8 cards were after they had gone behind by a goal or 2.Now me being proactive I'd like to go up to their coach and tell him my findings in the hope that he appreciates and then addresses it with his players as i'd feel thats useful info?Yes?"Look guys if we go down by a goal keep ya heads" sort a thing?I think that sort of open discussion should be ok......what dya think?....it would only take one daft coach though to turn round and say"oh i get it ref you're targeting my players are ya".......no win situation.....I'm still going to approach him i think?

This is a great point and one which could be brought up by refs to specific clubs. The refs can also comment back to the clubs about the abuse they may cop from the sidelines. If there is a continual pattern possibly a fine to the club can be imposed. A standard must be in place though. Something like if 5 games out of the first half of the season refs have reported abusive players or supporters, then a fine to the club will be issued. I know a club of our size would certainly act if we were getting a hefty fine every half of the season. I'm sure the clubs could then possibly bring in thier own systems to try and rectify the issue, (fines or bans).
PHE are trying to improve our sideline antics and i know it is very hard when you have a bad ref, but clubs must act on this.

I have been to many (St Peters) saturday games this year and i must say, they have got it right. There is very little to no abuse from the sidelines and the players and supporters rarely abuse or argue the decision. All of us sunday teams know they are soft , but it is more of a family atmosphere there and if you do swear you feel like you have comitted a crime. It seems a lot less angry and violet compared with some sunday games.

[goal!!!]

on a brighter note , did anyone watch michael creame ref the line ? i thought he done very well , he had some tough decisions and each replay showed a perfect decision on each .. the australian ref who ref'ed the actual game made some blunders.. got a bit yellow card trigger happy ..lol