FFSA league

[nugget66]

Is that the responsibility of someone who wants to play amateur league and kick a ball with their mates

Firstly, I don't think it's my responsibility. Secondly ten dollars is nothing... but don't these children have parents?
We in my opinion it is our responsibility.
There are a lot of amateurs for many obvious reasons and due to the flexibility the cost to run the comp are low.
There are less players involved in the elite setup and it cost more to run the league and youth development programs.

We all want to see football progress in our country. We cant expect the less to fund the program while the more watch and take joy out of the success of the less.

Also it is hard for coaches to access /update training techniques and accreditation.
This needs to be addressed as this is the way of improving the technical standard of our game throughout the population.

No moneys from the levy should go to running the senior elite comp.

Dosnt my club allready support the development of junior soccer in South Aust. by having 15 junior teams, putting coaches through courses ect. ect. ?

Also I wouldn't mind if the money was going to junior development in this state, my question is who is paying the 6 figure salary Mr Carter is on?

My other question is what is the financial position of the FFSA?
who would know, I find it hard to believe that the affiliated clubs don't even know & they wont disclose it?

Your club does support youth development with 15 kids teams but your senior players don't, or you have already inbuilt your own club levy. What about the amateur clubs without juniors?

I don't know enough about any discussion, agreement, who gets paid what etc etc. So i cant comment Nugget. I just know for improving the game we should be united. After all, we have a hard enough time getting credibility, sponsorship because we are competing with AFL, NRL and cricket.

Like I said before I want the same as you Ronald, but not at the expense of the grass roots soccer community.

[gunner_59]

It is the FFA's responsibilty..... by pure chance Les Murray has today posted an assessment of the state of the game.
http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/the-stat ... -1-142819/
In his first section on 'Community Standing' he states.....
A transition to credible management, under the leadership of Frank Lowy, has thrust football into a place where it can lethally harness the momentum of globalisation, a process that requires Australia to play ball with the rest of the world. And that, in short, means you can’t engage with the rest of the world, especially our region, through Aussie Rules, cricket or even rugby. It has to be football.
Governments are now recognising this. Business is recognising it. The media is recognising it. This means more funding from and higher engagement with government, bigger investment from business and more generous media space and air time allotted to football than at any time before.

And in his second section, Les gives a blunt assessment of the dilemna FFA has... it knows very well that the state run associations are hopeless but the quandary is that many of these people are passionate about the game and have extensive football knowledge.. just no sense!!
As Les stated....
On the financial side football is now a business of sizeable turnover, not quite up there with AFL or rugby league but fast nearing it. It is an expensive sport to run, its coffers regularly raided by the expense of running a myriad of national teams in innumerable regional and global competitions. Integration with Asia has been a heaven sent thing but, goodness, it has come at some cost.
But this is only the top of the football pyramid. The sea change Crawford prescribed at the breadth of the game is still a long way from having been achieved.
The peak of the pyramid, represented in the old days by sickly and amateurish administration and an ownership of the game by migrants, has been swept aside, replaced by a white veneer or purity and clean acceptability.
But at its lower tiers, at state and district levels, ‘old soccer’ was just as sick as it was at its top, maybe sicker, and this is yet to be addressed. The veneer is wafer thin.
The recent serious issues raised by Craig Foster concerning Football NSW are a symptom of this. The Australian game’s most powerful and biggest regional body is a living and breathing epitome of ‘old soccer’, fuelled by power, cronyism, politics and money, without the slightest regard for relevance in playing a part in football’s development.

[marooned]

Malcolm Mac wrote

Whos is it. The user who pays? So your suggestion with continue to turn football into a sport for people who can afford it.

We could all pay a $500 levy towards junior development. How would that attract or produce better players. Do you think that in Argentina or Brazil they pay a development levy? No of course not. They work on weight of numbers. More that play, more that succeed. A levy here only pays greedy mens wages


Ps Frank Lowy is currently under investigation for tax evation. 4 corners monday night.

[James]

Malcolm Mac wrote

Whos is it. The user who pays? So your suggestion with continue to turn football into a sport for people who can afford it.

We could all pay a $500 levy towards junior development. How would that attract or produce better players. Do you think that in Argentina or Brazil they pay a development levy? No of course not. They work on weight of numbers. More that play, more that succeed. A levy here only pays greedy mens wages


Ps Frank Lowy is currently under investigation for tax evation. 4 corners monday night.

It is their #1 sport, their religion. There is the weight of numbers. But when the kids get to the next level, sponsors will pick up their tab. Feed tmhem, provide their kits. Hard to get sponsor in our country for football.

[Missing Post Count]

Hard to get sponsor in our country for football.

Hardly the responsibilty of amateur players. Perhaps the FFSA is targeting the wrong people for money.
Many amateur clubs have to find their own sponsors to keep the club afloat.

[marooned]

Lowy denies tax dodge claims
Posted Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:44am AEST
Updated Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:57am AEST


Frank Lowy has emphatically denied the allegations. (AAP: Mick Tsikas, file photo)
The tax and banking activities of Australia's second richest man, Frank Lowy, and his family, are coming under the scrutiny of a powerful US Senate committee.

A hearing in Washington has been told that Mr Lowy and his sons hid tens of millions of dollars in the European tax haven of Liechtenstein.

Mr Lowy has emphatically denied the allegations.

The US loses up to $100 billion in tax revenue from offshore havens each year and the Lowy family, controllers of the giant Westfield shopping centre chain, is one of the case studies in what the committee describes as an "iron ring of secrecy".

The US Senate's Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations is the same body that probed Australia's former monopoly wheat exporter AWB in the Iraq oil for food scandal.

Now it is investigating international tax evasion, with allegations aimed at some of the wealthiest people in the world, including Mr Lowy and his family.

Committee chair and Democratic Senator Carl Levin told the hearing that "tax havens are engaged in economic warfare against the United States and against honest hardworking American taxpayers."

The claim against the Lowys is that they set up a secret bank account in Liechtenstein with the LGT bank, which is owned by the principality's royal family.

"Peter Lowy lives in California. His father - with his son's help - set up an LGT foundation in 1998 after telling the bank that he did not want Australian tax authorities to know about the assets. LGT took measures to hide the Lowys' ownership of the assets," Senator Levin alleged at the hearing.

Frank Lowy's son Peter Lowy is a US citizen and he had been subpoenaed to testify under oath.

"Yesterday Mr Lowy's attorney provided a letter stating that Mr Lowy would appear before the subcommittee for a hearing on July 25," Senator Levin said.

But Mr Lowy may not have a lot to say to the committee, like the three other witnesses who decided to stay silent, taking their constitutional fifth amendment option.


Denial

Frank Lowy has issued a statement saying he "totally rejects" the assertion that he or his family tried to hide ownership of assets from the Australian tax authorities.

He says neither he nor any member of his family has done anything improper and that the US subcommittee has denied his family natural justice.

[c[size=150]olor=#BF0040]Mr Lowy also pointed out that the $68 million held in the Liechtenstein bank account were distributed for charitable purposes in Israel some years ago.[/[/size]color]

The Senate subcommittee does not have the power to compel officials from the Liechtenstein bank to appear and they did not show up to the hearing.

Swiss banking giant UBS has also been accused of helping to hide assets from the IRS.

A senior officer today apologised to the Committee and said the bank would no longer provide offshore accounts to US residents


ASK FRANK FOR SOME FUNDING

[Car Park Keeper]

We could all pay a $500 levy towards junior development. How would that attract or produce better players. Do you think that in Argentina or Brazil they pay a development levy? No of course not. They work on weight of numbers. More that play, more that succeed. A levy here only pays greedy mens wages

I personally wouldnt want Mr Carters job for a seven figure salary. He probably, as most CEOs find he has been left with a white elephant. He now has to find a way of turning that elephant into a financially viable organisation. There are many ways to do this. The route he has chosen is not one of them. At the Downs we stuggled for many years before turning a profit, thanks to a business plan implemented by former chairman M Swann we were able to pin point our strong points and our weak points. We did not take the easy option of putting tariffs (taxes) on our players, in fact we gave them more for their money. Number one rule in the entertainment business is you must put *bums on seats. *Bums on seats has two advantages, turnover from sales of food and beverages and an atmosphere where people dont want to miss out on, hence more *bums on seats. This also attracts sponsors as they can place their product in front of a larger group. Our club is run as a business and not as a social network, social networks come and go usually leaving a string of debt behind. Mr Carter should realise by now his plan stinks and not attractive to most clubs. A rethink is needed.

Marooned I have to agree with your comments as the success of your club has really come in the last 10 years or so. I can remember Downs being top of Div 2, then struggling in Div 1. Now they are a powerhouse, financially stronger than most amateur clubs (if not all). Sustainable in the long run as well (ie not relying on 1 major sponsor).

Having been involved with an amateur afl club in Darwin as treasurer we set about doing things a bit differently. We focused on getting people involved with the club, sponsors, members & set about putting on good entertainment around the club. Some of these people became players, others supported the club. The point is that once they enjoyed themselves they spent money which fed to sponsors/back to the club. We even reduced player fees & became more profitable.

Apart from a few exceptions most clubs give sponsors/ spectators poor value so why would they consistently dig into their pockets?

The FFSA top job is money for jam really. It has been so poorly done for so long you really have nothing to lose by taking it on. However adding clubs is not the way to increase quality but a way of increasing revenue.

The current state league could almost be renamed the FFSA Metropolitan League.

[tickets4cheese]

hands up who thinks this thread will keep going back and forth until the new season starts as no one has anything better to talk about since the games finished.

[Car Park Keeper]

hands up who thinks this thread will keep going back and forth until the new season starts as no one has anything better to talk about since the games finished.

We still have a way to go to surpass the unknown player thread

[History]

thats better, no abuse this time

not sure, i'm sure you'll know soon enough

and we're not in the FFSA

what about you how are you enjoying the SAASL

are you trying to razz me up

haha - yeah busted was looking for more bites.

saasl is fine, like i said i just like playing football. oh and coming on here to wind people up.

thought so, good to see the humorous side of you

[History]

hands up who thinks this thread will keep going back and forth until the new season starts as no one has anything better to talk about since the games finished.

me

[tickets4cheese]

thats better, no abuse this time

not sure, i'm sure you'll know soon enough

and we're not in the FFSA

what about you how are you enjoying the SAASL

are you trying to razz me up

haha - yeah busted was looking for more bites.

saasl is fine, like i said i just like playing football. oh and coming on here to wind people up.

thought so, good to see the humorous side of you

need something to get me through the day.

[History]

Hmmmmm ok

now thats the life, work and forum

some people have the life

[tickets4cheese]

Hmmmmm ok

now thats the life, work and forum

some people have the life

sorry maybe a should've said need something to get me through the working day, i get paid lots to do nuthin so need to pass the time.

[History]

Hmmmmm ok

now thats the life, work and forum

some people have the life

sorry maybe a should've said need something to get me through the working day, i get paid lots to do nuthin so need to pass the time.

lets swap jobs

getting paid lots to do nothing and surf the forum... love it

[Missing Post Count]

hands up who thinks this thread will keep going back and forth until the new season starts as no one has anything better to talk about since the games finished.

We still have a way to go to surpass the unknown player thread

And the post sluts thread

[Bomber]

hands up who thinks this thread will keep going back and forth until the new season starts as no one has anything better to talk about since the games finished.

We still have a way to go to surpass the unknown player thread

And the post sluts thread

The question game is moving ahead rapidly as a major contender!!

[htfc]

The FFSA is out of touch with the development of the game in my opinion.

Surely the development of the game is to get as many kids invloved in that game as possible. The AFL recognize this with the Aus kick thing which is offered for very little cost. The mums of Australia are in love with the world game as they see it as a safer option for their kids to play as opposed to AFL or rugby. Do we really want to alienate these people by overbearing them with cost to subsidize the elite. No I dont think so. Sure we might not get the next Harry Kewell etc but what we will get is someone willing to fork out their dollars to watch Adelaide United or to get Foxtel to watch other international fixtures. It is this money that is really important to fund the development of the game. Take note it is the money from Foxtel that is basically paying the way for the FFA at the moment. The money raised from players levies etc really is chicken feed.

By the way, if i went to uni to study i end up with a hex fee. If i go to "study" football at SASI or the ASI i dont have to pay anything back. I see a problem here. Why dont players who go thru this system have any debt to pay back to the soccer community? This i feel is also a way to fund development. The elite, some who earn millions, should have a contractual obligation, to SASI or the ASI, to pay back their development cost. This can be done with transfers % or at a local level a levy on their pro wages etc.

Also i think state development of players is now an out of date option. It really should be up to the Adelaide Uniteds of Australia to develop players. They have greater commercial interests in discovering talent. Something that they can on sell to much richer clubs with huge financial gains ie the Burns and Djbtes. Dont see the Man Utds relying on state programs. Dont mention the french system. Thats only a finishing school for the already elite.

The SSG thing is also something that from a marketing angle will alienate alot of mums. They just want to see their kids play football like adelaide united. Isnt SSG what most coaches do at training anyway? Also kids can play SSG style game at school, 5-aside etc. Im sorry but I dont see the need.

Do you want more?

[swannsong]

The FFSA is out of touch with the development of the game in my opinion.

Surely the development of the game is to get as many kids invloved in that game as possible. The AFL recognize this with the Aus kick thing which is offered for very little cost. The mums of Australia are in love with the world game as they see it as a safer option for their kids to play as opposed to AFL or rugby. Do we really want to alienate these people by overbearing them with cost to subsidize the elite. No I dont think so. Sure we might not get the next Harry Kewell etc but what we will get is someone willing to fork out their dollars to watch Adelaide United or to get Foxtel to watch other international fixtures. It is this money that is really important to fund the development of the game. Take note it is the money from Foxtel that is basically paying the way for the FFA at the moment. The money raised from players levies etc really is chicken feed.

By the way, if i went to uni to study i end up with a hex fee. If i go to "study" football at SASI or the ASI i dont have to pay anything back. I see a problem here. Why dont players who go thru this system have any debt to pay back to the soccer community? This i feel is also a way to fund development. The elite, some who earn millions, should have a contractual obligation, to SASI or the ASI, to pay back their development cost. This can be done with transfers % or at a local level a levy on their pro wages etc.

Also i think state development of players is now an out of date option. It really should be up to the Adelaide Uniteds of Australia to develop players. They have greater commercial interests in discovering talent. Something that they can on sell to much richer clubs with huge financial gains ie the Burns and Djbtes. Dont see the Man Utds relying on state programs. Dont mention the french system. Thats only a finishing school for the already elite.

The SSG thing is also something that from a marketing angle will alienate alot of mums. They just want to see their kids play football like adelaide united. Isnt SSG what most coaches do at training anyway? Also kids can play SSG style game at school, 5-aside etc. Im sorry but I dont see the need.

Do you want more?

You're on a roll, keep going !

[marooned]

Its seems the pro FFSA bandwagon has hit a glitch and is resorting to idle chit chat and vulgar statements to fend off the pro SAASL lobby. I noticed there was no comment from anyone concerning the investigation of FFA boss Frank Lowy and his hidden assets. Bit to close to the bone one would think. Maybe an investigation into FFSA funds may be in order.

[Southampton #7]

As long as the money goes and continues to go to the right priority - youth development.

Charge there clubs the money, they already pay between $300.00 to $750.00 to play Feds,use that money for your elite players and leave the kids ,guys and girls who just want a kick alone....

[/quote]

That why the fees are so high. Are high fees stopping kids from entering the federation. Maybe.

no point arguing with u on this one Southhampton. I have my views and you have yours. (self focussed as they may seem)[/quote]

dont like kids being overcharged for playing soccer......

[Southampton #7]

The FFSA is out of touch with the development of the game in my opinion.

Surely the development of the game is to get as many kids invloved in that game as possible. The AFL recognize this with the Aus kick thing which is offered for very little cost. The mums of Australia are in love with the world game as they see it as a safer option for their kids to play as opposed to AFL or rugby. Do we really want to alienate these people by overbearing them with cost to subsidize the elite. No I dont think so. Sure we might not get the next Harry Kewell etc but what we will get is someone willing to fork out their dollars to watch Adelaide United or to get Foxtel to watch other international fixtures. It is this money that is really important to fund the development of the game. Take note it is the money from Foxtel that is basically paying the way for the FFA at the moment. The money raised from players levies etc really is chicken feed.

By the way, if i went to uni to study i end up with a hex fee. If i go to "study" football at SASI or the ASI i dont have to pay anything back. I see a problem here. Why dont players who go thru this system have any debt to pay back to the soccer community? This i feel is also a way to fund development. The elite, some who earn millions, should have a contractual obligation, to SASI or the ASI, to pay back their development cost. This can be done with transfers % or at a local level a levy on their pro wages etc.

Also i think state development of players is now an out of date option. It really should be up to the Adelaide Uniteds of Australia to develop players. They have greater commercial interests in discovering talent. Something that they can on sell to much richer clubs with huge financial gains ie the Burns and Djbtes. Dont see the Man Utds relying on state programs. Dont mention the french system. Thats only a finishing school for the already elite.

The SSG thing is also something that from a marketing angle will alienate alot of mums. They just want to see their kids play football like adelaide united. Isnt SSG what most coaches do at training anyway? Also kids can play SSG style game at school, 5-aside etc. Im sorry but I dont see the need.

Do you want more?

yes

[Car Park Keeper]

The FFSA is out of touch with the development of the game in my opinion.

Surely the development of the game is to get as many kids invloved in that game as possible. The AFL recognize this with the Aus kick thing which is offered for very little cost. The mums of Australia are in love with the world game as they see it as a safer option for their kids to play as opposed to AFL or rugby. Do we really want to alienate these people by overbearing them with cost to subsidize the elite. No I dont think so. Sure we might not get the next Harry Kewell etc but what we will get is someone willing to fork out their dollars to watch Adelaide United or to get Foxtel to watch other international fixtures. It is this money that is really important to fund the development of the game. Take note it is the money from Foxtel that is basically paying the way for the FFA at the moment. The money raised from players levies etc really is chicken feed.

By the way, if i went to uni to study i end up with a hex fee. If i go to "study" football at SASI or the ASI i dont have to pay anything back. I see a problem here. Why dont players who go thru this system have any debt to pay back to the soccer community? This i feel is also a way to fund development. The elite, some who earn millions, should have a contractual obligation, to SASI or the ASI, to pay back their development cost. This can be done with transfers % or at a local level a levy on their pro wages etc.

Also i think state development of players is now an out of date option. It really should be up to the Adelaide Uniteds of Australia to develop players. They have greater commercial interests in discovering talent. Something that they can on sell to much richer clubs with huge financial gains ie the Burns and Djbtes. Dont see the Man Utds relying on state programs. Dont mention the french system. Thats only a finishing school for the already elite.

The SSG thing is also something that from a marketing angle will alienate alot of mums. They just want to see their kids play football like adelaide united. Isnt SSG what most coaches do at training anyway? Also kids can play SSG style game at school, 5-aside etc. Im sorry but I dont see the need.

Do you want more?

Have to say I agree with you on most points. Elite players should fund more of elite player development programs in some way. Either a levy or a cut of transfer fees.

Some players do (I know that Lucas Neill has an academy in NSW) and I am sure that there are others. However those that do this would be small when compared to the number of players that have made lucrative careers (particularly when part of their development was done through taxpayer funded money) from the game.

SASI & the like were set up prior to Adelaide United/ Hyundai A League and have probably run their race. It would be better for Adelaide United or other clubs to run academies for young players. That way there is better use of facilities which lets face it are always going to be scarce in Adelaide. No matter how we see it will always rank below Aussie Rules in this state (in terms of $, political mileage etc).

SSGs are a good idea as watching junior games over the years has allowed those with greater physical attributes (ie often early developers physically a huge advantage). Often the player who can play at the back can beat half the side or in some games the whole side because they have so much space. Very rarely do these players become great players as they don't have the close control that they need. SSGs will tend to improve this.

[htfc]

Lets talk about the FFSA structure.

The FFSA and the FFA are corporate bodies. That is the have CEOs appointed by a board to run the organization as they see fit. If football is united under this one body effectively what we will have is a monopoly on the running of football in this country. Im sorry but is it only me that sees a problem with this. Isnt this also something the TPA should be concerned about. Sure the governing body will never go broke as they can charge whatever they like to make up any financial losses. Speaking of finances. Does anyone know the financial position of the FFSA? No! And thats the way it will remain as they have no obligation under their current consitution to reveal any financial information. Infact the FFSA seems good at not revealing information on anything full stop.

I read something Les Murray said about the rosie state of football in Aust now. Sure it will look good from the top down if you're charged with running football in this country. Its money for jam really. Come down and sit with someone running a club at grass roots level, aka an SAASL club, and look up. All you see and hear is the elite need this, the FFSA need money for development, and a big wig executive on a large salary is telling us whats good for football. Talk about alienation. My job at grass roots is to try and get people involved in the game, using volunteers, getting enough equipement and facilities etc all on a very tight budget. Cant people see why the SAASL and E&DJSA dont want a part of this?

By the way does anyone know who is on the board of the FFSA? Do you know how they get there? A bunch of lawyers and solicitors who have had very little dealings with soccer at a grass root level. Sure they know their corporate stuff, but have little insight as to the hands on delivery of the game. And its the other corporate boffs from the FFA who appoint them.

It is this corporate structure and lack of transparency that has me most worried. A guarantee on costs today offers me little assurance. A new board, a new CEO have every right under the constitution to re-address costs upwards while offering little (actually none) opportunity for the average joe running a club to seek justification.

By the way how is basketball going in this country/state Mr Carter?

Any more?

[marooned]

How Huddersfield doing this year? Dont forget you dancing shoes tommorow night and leave your wobbly boots at home.

[nugget66]

Lets talk about the FFSA structure.

The FFSA and the FFA are corporate bodies. That is the have CEOs appointed by a board to run the organization as they see fit. If football is united under this one body effectively what we will have is a monopoly on the running of football in this country. Im sorry but is it only me that sees a problem with this. Isnt this also something the TPA should be concerned about. Sure the governing body will never go broke as they can charge whatever they like to make up any financial losses. Speaking of finances. Does anyone know the financial position of the FFSA? No! And thats the way it will remain as they have no obligation under their current consitution to reveal any financial information. Infact the FFSA seems good at not revealing information on anything full stop.

I read something Les Murray said about the rosie state of football in Aust now. Sure it will look good from the top down if you're charged with running football in this country. Its money for jam really. Come down and sit with someone running a club at grass roots level, aka an SAASL club, and look up. All you see and hear is the elite need this, the FFSA need money for development, and a big wig executive on a large salary is telling us whats good for football. Talk about alienation. My job at grass roots is to try and get people involved in the game, using volunteers, getting enough equipement and facilities etc all on a very tight budget. Cant people see why the SAASL and E&DJSA dont want a part of this?

By the way does anyone know who is on the board of the FFSA? Do you know how they get there? A bunch of lawyers and solicitors who have had very little dealings with soccer at a grass root level. Sure they know their corporate stuff, but have little insight as to the hands on delivery of the game. And its the other corporate boffs from the FFA who appoint them.

It is this corporate structure and lack of transparency that has me most worried. A guarantee on costs today offers me little assurance. A new board, a new CEO have every right under the constitution to re-address costs upwards while offering little (actually none) opportunity for the average joe running a club to seek justification.

By the way how is basketball going in this country/state Mr Carter?

Any more?

BRAVO htfc

[lefty]

Lets talk about the FFSA structure.

The FFSA and the FFA are corporate bodies. That is the have CEOs appointed by a board to run the organization as they see fit. If football is united under this one body effectively what we will have is a monopoly on the running of football in this country. Im sorry but is it only me that sees a problem with this. Isnt this also something the TPA should be concerned about. Sure the governing body will never go broke as they can charge whatever they like to make up any financial losses. Speaking of finances. Does anyone know the financial position of the FFSA? No! And thats the way it will remain as they have no obligation under their current consitution to reveal any financial information. Infact the FFSA seems good at not revealing information on anything full stop.

I read something Les Murray said about the rosie state of football in Aust now. Sure it will look good from the top down if you're charged with running football in this country. Its money for jam really. Come down and sit with someone running a club at grass roots level, aka an SAASL club, and look up. All you see and hear is the elite need this, the FFSA need money for development, and a big wig executive on a large salary is telling us whats good for football. Talk about alienation. My job at grass roots is to try and get people involved in the game, using volunteers, getting enough equipement and facilities etc all on a very tight budget. Cant people see why the SAASL and E&DJSA dont want a part of this?

By the way does anyone know who is on the board of the FFSA? Do you know how they get there? A bunch of lawyers and solicitors who have had very little dealings with soccer at a grass root level. Sure they know their corporate stuff, but have little insight as to the hands on delivery of the game. And its the other corporate boffs from the FFA who appoint them.

It is this corporate structure and lack of transparency that has me most worried. A guarantee on costs today offers me little assurance. A new board, a new CEO have every right under the constitution to re-address costs upwards while offering little (actually none) opportunity for the average joe running a club to seek justification.

By the way how is basketball going in this country/state Mr Carter?

Any more?

Spot on and this MC fool at FFSA thought he could pull the wool over our Alex Cichanowski's eyes. Nice try

[TheWingBack]

Having watched this interesting swap of ideas and opinions for the last few days I think there are a few missing pieces of information that we don't have (well I don't anyway) and which we need to be provided by the FFSA before clubs and individuals can make their decisions. Plus considering that it always takes time to distribute communications and we're getting into the festive period they're cutting it short.

So what I think is missing is:

1. How will this "theoretical" Metro league be run, setup, managed and cost?
2. Why does the FFSA think that SAASL clubs should come across to the Metro League? (Yes I know the FFSA have spoken to the state/premier/super league clubs to add their own amateur teams, but not likely is it)
3. What provisions have been made to ensure the Metro League, as an amateur competition, remains affordable, for example the SAASL charges about $38ish per player for registration while the last I heard SAWSA (which is part of the FFSA now) charges about $100/$110 per player and have their own "paid" CEO. At the end of the day with the cost of living rising us players need to remain able to afford being able to play and pay our fees.
4. Will the Metro League separate itself from the state/premier/super leagues so that monies raised by that group go back into the amateur competition rather than subsiding the "elite" groups and in turn increasing the cost on amateur players?
5. How will the FFSA promise A and B team referees in the Metro League, especially on a Saturday?

Obviously my view here is ensuring the state of amateur football improves and remains affordable so clubs can recruit and maintain players rather than it becoming an overly expensive sport when the equipment necessary is minimal and players aren't paid (OK yes I know some amateur clubs pay, but that's their decision and is mainly done by clubs with sterong finances and in high divisions, I'm going the holistic view here).

[kramerica]

Guss your the tool of the year your award is in the post!!!!
The FFSA is a bunch of broke ass wankers that have never promoted our game to the fullest. Look at the hindmarsh debacle.
They have to many takers that are only in it for themselves.
It doesn't matter what you say the SAASL has been around for over 40yrs and are in the black where abouts is the FFSA.
Why go backwards when the SAASL has come so far and can only improve with the right criticism.
So I say to you, I think you've been sniffing your sisters knickers far to much mate and the yeast infections over the years are starting to take their toll. Leave em in the wash basket and go back to your dad skid marks.

Guus isn't the tool. He makes some valid points, just read between the lines and it will be clear what he's trying to say. This is what I have picked up about his posts and I am on the same wave length. Its not about which is better or which is bankrupt etc, I believe he is associated with an SAASL club and so am I, but the potential issues of the two leagues not working together.

Let me tell you a tip for next year, and anyone else that hasn't read between the lines, playing or associated with an SAASL club. Round up all your FFSA buddies that you know and get them registered with your SAASL club, so they can play for you as well as there FFSA club, when you need them or after the FFSA season is finished. Yeah you heard me, how is the SAASL going to police this? The FFSA are not talking/exchanging any info with the SAASL, this is there stance and they have made it clear, I/we can dual register FFSA players?? You got that?? How are the SAASL going to stop this???

Get of your high horses and proud history, FIFA is a powerful organisation, and the consequences of not negotiating with them will become aparent in the years to come, so you want your history (and your clubs should be proud), then start thinking about the future.

[swannsong]

Guss your the tool of the year your award is in the post!!!!
The FFSA is a bunch of broke ass wankers that have never promoted our game to the fullest. Look at the hindmarsh debacle.
They have to many takers that are only in it for themselves.
It doesn't matter what you say the SAASL has been around for over 40yrs and are in the black where abouts is the FFSA.
Why go backwards when the SAASL has come so far and can only improve with the right criticism.
So I say to you, I think you've been sniffing your sisters knickers far to much mate and the yeast infections over the years are starting to take their toll. Leave em in the wash basket and go back to your dad skid marks.

Guus isn't the tool. He makes some valid points, just read between the lines and it will be clear what he's trying to say. This is what I have picked up about his posts and I am on the same wave length. Its not about which is better or which is bankrupt etc, I believe he is associated with an SAASL club and so am I, but the potential issues of the two leagues not working together.

Let me tell you a tip for next year, and anyone else that hasn't read between the lines, playing or associated with an SAASL club. Round up all your FFSA buddies that you know and get them registered with your SAASL club, so they can play for you as well as there FFSA club, when you need them or after the FFSA season is finished. Yeah you heard me, how is the SAASL going to police this? The FFSA are not talking/exchanging any info with the SAASL, this is there stance and they have made it clear, I/we can dual register FFSA players?? You got that?? How are the SAASL going to stop this???

Get of your high horses and proud history, FIFA is a powerful organisation, and the consequences of not negotiating with them will become aparent in the years to come, so you want your history (and your clubs should be proud), then start thinking about the future.

I think you might find you might have used the wrong word to back up your argument.

Negotiate :
1 a: to deal with (some matter or affair that requires ability for its successful handling) : manage b: to arrange for or bring about through conference, discussion, and compromise

FFSA are not talking or discussing (with anybody it seems let alone the SAASL).
The FFSA do not seem to want to compromise despite SAASL's agreement in part.
I'm not sure anyone at, or involved with the SAASL, do not want to be recognised by FIFA, that is not the issue.
The issue is whether or not FFSA and their stance is the right means of achieving that recognition.
To completely ignore management and governance issues would demonstate a total lack of foresight and negligence for two thirds of the football community in SA.
As for dual registration, there have been bigger hurdles than that to get over for the SAASL to reach where it is at now!