Lady Reds Coach To Quit

[sportsbird]

Im sorry otto62
I dont need to talk to them in leaving. There leaving on there own accord.

[bambam]

Hi sportsbird
I have also heard that players are are wanting to leave because they are unhappy in the environemnt.
Some are staying only because they dont want to miss the boat.
Its unfortunate.

[sportsbird]

Hi sportsbird
I have also heard that players are are wanting to leave because they are unhappy in the environemnt.
Some are staying only because they dont want to miss the boat.
Its unfortunate.

bambam,
I agree with you, whilst RA is head coach, these players will not be given the opportunity because it is all about his credibility.
But If the players do get an opportunity, it's short lived.
Players that were asked to join the Lady Reds Squad only to be told to go back to their club after one or two games.
I'm glad I have retired and don't have to put up with the crap directed at us women.

[MegaBonus]

put up with the crap directed at us women.

are you suggesting that women should be treated differently to men?????????

[sportsbird]

Absolutely we are not men and we will not be able to compete at their level.
Therefore we should be treated as women and coached to the best of our ability.

[gone]

Absolutely we are not men and we will not be able to compete at their level.
Therefore we should be treated as women and coached to the best of our ability.

[paul merson]

Absolutely we are not men and we will not be able to compete at their level.
Therefore we should be treated as women and coached to the best of our ability.

And then complain later that you're not treated equally.

[Lucas Leiva]

Absolutely we are not men and we will not be able to compete at their level.
Therefore we should be treated as women and coached to the best of our ability.

And then complain later that you're not treated equally.

I see where Sportsbird is coming from on this one Mers.

There's no one approach - it should be that they're treated as women at the appropriate times (ie. no sprays at one player in front of the group at HT) and treated as equals at other times (facilities, funding and - ironically - accessibility to good coaches).

Interestingly, RA was at a Women in Sport presentation about a year ago (also featuring Jan Stirling among others) and spoke at length about how he changes some things for the women but not others. Perhaps the approach didn't work in the end for him.

[paul merson]

Absolutely we are not men and we will not be able to compete at their level.
Therefore we should be treated as women and coached to the best of our ability.

And then complain later that you're not treated equally.

I see where Sportsbird is coming from on this one Mers.

There's no one approach - it should be that they're treated as women at the appropriate times (ie. no sprays at one player in front of the group at HT) and treated as equals at other times (facilities, funding and - ironically - accessibility to good coaches).

Interestingly, RA was at a Women in Sport presentation about a year ago (also featuring Jan Stirling among others) and spoke at length about how he changes some things for the women but not others. Perhaps the approach didn't work in the end for him.

Ironically when I worked with the GKs at AU they asked me to 'treat them like the guys'.

With the no sprays thing, is it a male to female thing or would a female coach to female players be accepted? Serious question by the way, I personally would feel uncomfortable losing it at a female but horses for courses really.
Being treated equally for funding? Does that not work both ways, equal fees?
-Accessibility to good coaches? Ross shoed in men's football he is, Mike Barnett won the Men's premier league.
To me you treat players in a way to get the best out of them, being everybody is different you have to attack this issue from many directions, whether male or female, Im pretty sure I take things differently to some of the other guys in my team.

[sportsbird]

Absolutely we are not men and we will not be able to compete at their level.
Therefore we should be treated as women and coached to the best of our ability.

And then complain later that you're not treated equally.

I see where Sportsbird is coming from on this one Mers.

There's no one approach - it should be that they're treated as women at the appropriate times (ie. no sprays at one player in front of the group at HT) and treated as equals at other times (facilities, funding and - ironically - accessibility to good coaches).

Interestingly, RA was at a Women in Sport presentation about a year ago (also featuring Jan Stirling among others) and spoke at length about how he changes some things for the women but not others. Perhaps the approach didn't work in the end for him.

Hi Lucas Leiva,
You hit the nail on the head. That is exactly what I meant. I could not have said any better.

As for Paul Merson, since you have been involved with AU, what is your opinion why our elite players are deciding to quit or head interstate and why we cannot use our current SA crop which have been under RA regime for two years?

[juniorsupporter]

To me you treat players in a way to get the best out of them, being everybody is different you have to attack this issue from many directions, whether male or female, Im pretty sure I take things differently to some of the other guys in my team.[/quote]

This is a very good point. And important in terms of individual player development-

[paul merson]

And then complain later that you're not treated equally.

I see where Sportsbird is coming from on this one Mers.

There's no one approach - it should be that they're treated as women at the appropriate times (ie. no sprays at one player in front of the group at HT) and treated as equals at other times (facilities, funding and - ironically - accessibility to good coaches).

Interestingly, RA was at a Women in Sport presentation about a year ago (also featuring Jan Stirling among others) and spoke at length about how he changes some things for the women but not others. Perhaps the approach didn't work in the end for him.

Hi Lucas Leiva,
You hit the nail on the head. That is exactly what I meant. I could not have said any better.

As for Paul Merson, since you have been involved with AU, what is your opinion why our elite players are deciding to quit or head interstate and why we cannot use our current SA crop which have been under RA regime for two years?

To be honest I don't know any of the current crop, I don't know what happens atm at AU behind closed doors so my guess is as good as any, its just a guess.
Why would players be heading interstate? AU is hardly a glamor team of women's football is it (keep it purely football guys!), they never really got away from the foot of the table so players from interstate coming here would have their own agenda and players from here leave because they want to play as high as they can, nobody wants to lose every week.
Just because RA has had players for 2 years doesn't mean they're going to be good enough, Im sure he has a plan, but with out actually talking to him about it its just guess work.
What you have to ask is, is AU a reflection of SA women's football?
Is the women's prem league strong enough to produce 20+ players of national league quality?
I don't watch the prem league any more so honest questions, are we expecting a a skyscraper to be built on gravel or do we have a solid foundation?

[sportsbird]

Hi Paul,
In relation to your comment, "Is the women's prem league strong enough to produce 20+ players of national league quality?"
Yes there are current players that are strong enough to play. One classical example is Isabella Scalzi who has been a great and consistent defender in the prem league but has been overlooked as a Lady Reds player. Why?

[paul merson]

Hi Paul,
In relation to your comment, "Is the women's prem league strong enough to produce 20+ players of national league quality?"
Yes there are current players that are strong enough to play. One classical example is Isabella Scalzi who has been a great and consistent defender in the prem league but has been overlooked as a Lady Reds player. Why?

I'd have to take your word for it as I don't know the girl or have seen her play, but that is 1, is she good by AU bench mark or by w league bench mark, bearing in mind AU are near the bottom.

In defence of her not being selected, coaches see different things in different players, it doesn't mean she's not good enough it just means she doesn't fit what that coach is looking for, its a game of opinions, everyone who loves the game has one and you can guarantee there's plenty of conflicting ones around.

[juniorsupporter]

I would also add that it isn't just about players being capable- it's about them being willing AND able to make the commitment- not like men's game where players can survive on a salary that they get from playing. Women have to have flexible jobs, or be willing to put school or a career on hold in order to train full time and not get paid. It's not as simple as "are there 20+ players in the local Premier League who are good enough".

[Worthless Gobemouche]

Hi Paul,
In relation to your comment, "Is the women's prem league strong enough to produce 20+ players of national league quality?"
Yes there are current players that are strong enough to play. One classical example is Isabella Scalzi who has been a great and consistent defender in the prem league but has been overlooked as a Lady Reds player. Why?

I'd have to take your word for it as I don't know the girl or have seen her play, but that is 1, is she good by AU bench mark or by w league bench mark, bearing in mind AU are near the bottom.

In defence of her not being selected, coaches see different things in different players, it doesn't mean she's not good enough it just means she doesn't fit what that coach is looking for, its a game of opinions, everyone who loves the game has one and you can guarantee there's plenty of conflicting ones around.

And herein lies one of the problems with womens football in SA.

Player 'A' is considered good and a possible W League standard player. Her club coaches , team mates , parents and friends tell her she should be in the AUWFC squad, but for reasons 'unknown' she isn't selected.

This causes a case of sour grapes, mud slinging occurs because 'the current side is regularly towards the bottom of the league'. The clubs and players blame the coach. Coach blames the standard of local Premier League players and coaching standards. It's a viscous circle and constantly goes around every year.

So Player 'A' looks elsewhere and her club is left to face the fact that she wont be playing for them every year.

Of course on the other hand, that Player 'A' could be the talented youngster selected into the FFSA / NTC squad and then at the end of that tenure is told by the coaches 'If you want to play W League, don't bother playing at this or that club, go here'....plenty of broken promises propping up coaches with ambitions of greatness and delusions of grandeur.

[paul merson]

I would also add that it isn't just about players being capable- it's about them being willing AND able to make the commitment- not like men's game where players can survive on a salary that they get from playing. Women have to have flexible jobs, or be willing to put school or a career on hold in order to train full time and not get paid. It's not as simple as "are there 20+ players in the local Premier League who are good enough".

Fair point, I should have added '& willing'. (not just willing to play but make that commitment, yes as males we put everything on hold to chase a full time contract, it is a big ask of the girls so you have to take your hat off to those that do)

[pvfc]

There are many and varied reasons why some high quality local players (who are in many people's opinions good enough for "W League") don't get selected.
Sometimes they are not interested as some other people have said, sometimes timing and circumstances conspire against them, etc, etc.
Many people said my daughter should have made the W league squad, but things conspired against her - eg in the last 2 seasons RA never actually saw her play (because of an ACL injury she only played about 8 or 9 games during the past 2 seasons). She is now interstate and enjoying her football there. Would she still have taken the opportunity with the Lady Reds if she was still here in SA and was offered a spot in the squad this year? - too right she would! Is she bitter about how things panned out over the past few years with DE & RA? - I would say disappointed rather than bitter. Being bitter only limits your future opportunities, and some people would do well to remember that.

[juniorsupporter]

Mers- fair point, although even if a guy is chasing a bigger contract, he's still getting paid more to play in the local NPL than most W-League players.

[sportsbird]

Hi Paul,
In relation to your comment, "Is the women's prem league strong enough to produce 20+ players of national league quality?"
Yes there are current players that are strong enough to play. One classical example is Isabella Scalzi who has been a great and consistent defender in the prem league but has been overlooked as a Lady Reds player. Why?

I'd have to take your word for it as I don't know the girl or have seen her play, but that is 1, is she good by AU bench mark or by w league bench mark, bearing in mind AU are near the bottom.

In defence of her not being selected, coaches see different things in different players, it doesn't mean she's not good enough it just means she doesn't fit what that coach is looking for, its a game of opinions, everyone who loves the game has one and you can guarantee there's plenty of conflicting ones around.

And herein lies one of the problems with womens football in SA.

Player 'A' is considered good and a possible W League standard player. Her club coaches , team mates , parents and friends tell her she should be in the AUWFC squad, but for reasons 'unknown' she isn't selected.

This causes a case of sour grapes, mud slinging occurs because 'the current side is regularly towards the bottom of the league'. The clubs and players blame the coach. Coach blames the standard of local Premier League players and coaching standards. It's a viscous circle and constantly goes around every year.

So Player 'A' looks elsewhere and her club is left to face the fact that she wont be playing for them every year.

Of course on the other hand, that Player 'A' could be the talented youngster selected into the FFSA / NTC squad and then at the end of that tenure is told by the coaches 'If you want to play W League, don't bother playing at this or that club, go here'....plenty of broken promises propping up coaches with ambitions of greatness and delusions of grandeur.

Worthless,
You mentioned the following "Of course on the other hand, that Player 'A' could be the talented youngster selected into the FFSA / NTC squad and then at the end of that tenure is told by the coaches 'If you want to play W League, don't bother playing at this or that club, go here'....plenty of broken promises propping up coaches with ambitions of greatness and delusions of grandeur."

Your comments are absolutely true. RA had encouraged players to go to a particular club if they wished to be selected in the W league in the future.
This is detrimental to those clubs that lose experienced players because of RA ridiculous personal agenda.
It is also a great concern to the players future and confidence should they accept RA advice only to be let down after being overlooked.

I will re-iterate again that it's in the best interest of Women's Football in SA that RA should resign.
I know RA won't resign because of his own ego, then FFSA should bite the bullet and appoint a suitable head coach, whether male or female, who has the passion and the desire to succeed with their interest in the future of players, clubs and supporters.

[bambam]

Sportsgirl,
I have also heard of similar advice given to ex NTC players. There have also been verbal insults about their physical appearance hurled at particular players in the presence of other players. This behaviour should not be condoned or tolerated at any level by any coaches.
These coaches need to be aware they are in a position of developing and nurturing young ladies (from 14 years of age) to become elite players.
They have not reached adulthood yet.
So, I am in support of sportsbird's comment that the FFSA should start a fresh with appointing a well respected and experienced Head Coach of Women's Football.

[MegaBonus]

^^^^^^^^^^^

being responsible for developing 'young ladies' or 'footballers'

Ladies and gentlemen.....I give Gen Y

[Socca]

There are many and varied reasons why some high quality local players (who are in many people's opinions good enough for "W League") don't get selected.
Sometimes they are not interested as some other people have said, sometimes timing and circumstances conspire against them, etc, etc.
Many people said my daughter should have made the W league squad, but things conspired against her - eg in the last 2 seasons RA never actually saw her play (because of an ACL injury she only played about 8 or 9 games during the past 2 seasons). She is now interstate and enjoying her football there. Would she still have taken the opportunity with the Lady Reds if she was still here in SA and was offered a spot in the squad this year? - too right she would! Is she bitter about how things panned out over the past few years with DE & RA? - I would say disappointed rather than bitter. Being bitter only limits your future opportunities, and some people would do well to remember that.

So she is disappointed (not bitter) how things have panned out with DE & RA over past few years, yet she's only played 8-9 games in the last 2 seasons ?

Interesting

[pvfc]

OK - to be more specific; was disappointed DE talked her up in front of all the other NTC players on several occasions including at the NTC Challenge and then left her out of WL squad at the last second, then disappointed not to have been in a position to be able to prove herself to the new coach RA due to injury (of course not RA's fault) during the following 2 years.
This is all in the past now anyway, but I was trying to give an example to try to answer the question about whether there are enough W-League quality players in SA and why we haven't seen them in squads. Also trying to say that even if players have issues with coaches they should try to stay positive and not get bitter about it as you never know what's around the corner (some comments from others seem certainly seem very negative and bitter).
I believe there have been several "SA developed" players over the past few years who arguably were or are good enough for WL but didn't make the squad because of circumstances similar to those I mentioned above or in my previous post, and probably several other reasons too such as now playing interstate or in the USA, etc.

[sportsbird]

Hi pvfc
I understood exactly what you were saying. It was clear.
My question now is who is actually in charge of the NTC while RA is away.
Apparently the assistant coach is to busy with coaching his boys team that he does not have time for the womens NTC.
I hope the FFSA are aware of this as the NTC is subsidised
wholly from the FFA.
I would hate if the FFA finds out that the money they put forward for the development of the players is being wasted.
Currently the NTC players are being told on a continuous basis there is no training and even they are questioning the program.
The players had enough.
Again so much for the development program and the future of these players.
When will the FFSA get of their laurels and do something about it instead of looking after RA.
Its about the players future not you.

[gone]

And herein lies one of the problems with womens football in SA.

Player 'A' is considered good and a possible W League standard player. Her club coaches , team mates , parents and friends tell her she should be in the AUWFC squad, but for reasons 'unknown' she isn't selected.

This causes a case of sour grapes, mud slinging occurs because 'the current side is regularly towards the bottom of the league'. The clubs and players blame the coach. Coach blames the standard of local Premier League players and coaching standards. It's a viscous circle and constantly goes around every year.

So Player 'A' looks elsewhere and her club is left to face the fact that she wont be playing for them every year.

Of course on the other hand, that Player 'A' could be the talented youngster selected into the FFSA / NTC squad and then at the end of that tenure is told by the coaches 'If you want to play W League, don't bother playing at this or that club, go here'....plenty of broken promises propping up coaches with ambitions of greatness and delusions of grandeur.

Worthless,
You mentioned the following "Of course on the other hand, that Player 'A' could be the talented youngster selected into the FFSA / NTC squad and then at the end of that tenure is told by the coaches 'If you want to play W League, don't bother playing at this or that club, go here'....plenty of broken promises propping up coaches with ambitions of greatness and delusions of grandeur."

Your comments are absolutely true. RA had encouraged players to go to a particular club if they wished to be selected in the W league in the future. This is detrimental to those clubs that lose experienced players because of RA ridiculous personal agenda. It is also a great concern to the players future and confidence should they accept RA advice only to be let down after being overlooked.

I will re-iterate again that it's in the best interest of Women's Football in SA that RA should resign. I know RA won't resign because of his own ego, then FFSA should bite the bullet and appoint a suitable head coach, whether male or female, who has the passion and the desire to succeed with their interest in the future of players, clubs and supporters.

When I was coaching a women's team in the mid 90's my best players were being told by their state team coaches to leave Stirling and join another team (sometimes naming one or two particular teams). I agree that it's not right to do that sort of thing, but don't try and make out that it's something that's only happening now because of RA and his "ridiculous personal agenda".

[Finding Sportsbird]

The ntc girls actually have a monthly program as to when trainings are and where. Also the ntc girls are training 3 times a week plus another day for strength and conditioning plus an individual home session so that makes it 5 sessions plus game day so work it out. Also they played fantastic on Sunday played some really good football and won. Just ask the current parents who were there at the game.

[BillShankly]

NTC girls did play very well.
The front 3 combined really well, and there movement off the ball was exceptional.

[gone]

Well, well, well. Best wishes to them.

[Socca]

The ntc girls actually have a monthly program as to when trainings are and where. Also the ntc girls are training 3 times a week plus another day for strength and conditioning plus an individual home session so that makes it 5 sessions plus game day so work it out. Also they played fantastic on Sunday played some really good football and won. Just ask the current parents who were there at the game.

But sportsbird said

Currently the NTC players are being told on a continuous basis there is no training and even they are questioning the program.
The players had enough.

?