Players urge year-long suspension of the Italian League

BAGGIO 15 · Post by **BAGGIO 15** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:31 pm

The Playersâ€™ Association has urged the suspension of Italian football Leagues for a whole year after the latest tragic incidents.

â€œFootball should stop for a year to reflect on all the evil that comes from it. The culture that surrounds our sport is wrong and has to be revolutionised. We need patience for that to happen and maybe passing on to another generation,â€ said AIC President Sergio Campana.

The FIGC called a halt to all Serie A, B, C and Youth Championship games this weekend after the riots that marred the Sicilian derby.

A 38-year-old policeman was killed in the battles with Catania supporters following Palermoâ€™s 2-1 victory at the Stadio Massimino.

At the moment it is unclear when the fixture list will resume, but the Players Association is urging for a definitive stance.

â€œI think that faced with these events, football should stop for a year and see if we can change our whole approach to sport,â€ continued Campana.

â€œWe have for some time been pointing out that there are weekly attacks on players because they lose a game. This means the very culture of sport in this country is wrong. Right when football is trying to rediscover its credibility after Calciopoli, this sort of thing leaves us dumbfounded.â€

The last time Serie A ground to a halt over fan violence was on February 5, 1995, when Genoa supporter Vincenzo Spagnolo was stabbed to death ahead of a match against Milan.

â€œThe death of a policeman in Catania and the many injuries as a result of this riot is a disturbing turn of events that calls for drastic measures,â€ said Minister for Sport Giovanna Melandri.

â€œThe Government will no longer tolerate the need for thousands of police officers in every match to ensure the safety of its citizens. Along with the Home Office Minister Giuliano Amato, we consider the suspension of the next round of games to be an opportune decision by the FIGC.

â€œThe Government and the world of sport must come together now to make sure the Leagues begin again in a totally different way.â€

The Sicilian derby was the final straw in a situation that has been growing in the peninsula.

In March 2004 the Rome derby was abandoned at half-time after reports â€“ which later proved to be false â€“ suggested a child had been run over and killed by a police van outside the Stadio Olimpico. This claim prompted extreme tension and riots.

The most tragic incident was only last week, when Sammartinese director Ermanno Licursi died from a brain haemorrhage when a fight broke out between opposition players in the Calabrian amateur League. It emerged he had been kicked in the head.

Fred Goldstone · Post by **Fred Goldstone** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:37 pm

Time for FIFA to step in and ban all Italian teams from International competitions for five years.

They did it to England and it worked pretty well.

There is nowhere near the amount of violence in the UK now compared to Italy, Holland and France.

The problem is that FIFA is too gutless to act against Italy because they have a lot of influence on the various boards.

BAGGIO 15 · Post by **BAGGIO 15** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:16 pm

Fred Goldstone wrote:Time for FIFA to step in and ban all Italian teams from International competitions for five years.

They did it to England and it worked pretty well.

There is nowhere near the amount of violence in the UK now compared to Italy, Holland and France.

The problem is that FIFA is too gutless to act against Italy because they have a lot of influence on the various boards.

There is a difference to the many killed in the Juve V LIverpool game then to the police man killed out side the stadium, but yes something drastic has to be done to stop the violence. England have been proactive and have had great results, but afes doco's of lat show that the English and many other European leagues violence has become more secretive in the oraganising of fights instead of out in the open like in Italy.

Fred Goldstone · Post by **Fred Goldstone** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:27 pm

Yes there is a difference English fans are kless of a problem, Italian fans have got worse.
The Juventus fans were hardly innocent at Heysel they just got the shit kicked out of them by a larger and even more vicious mob.

BAGGIO 15 · Post by **BAGGIO 15** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:30 pm

Fred Goldstone wrote:Yes there is a difference English fans are kless of a problem, Italian fans have got worse.
The Juventus fans were hardly innocent at Heysel they just got the cabernet kicked out of them by a larger and even more vicious mob.

I use the event as a whole, as an example, not laying blame.
Italian violence has risen, just don't want others to think the problem no longer exists in the UK. It's a football issue that needs cleaning up world wide, just more intensly in some countries.

Fred Goldstone · Post by **Fred Goldstone** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:38 pm

Most of the problems are not caused by football fans it is mainly organised street gangs and political gangs that use the football as a venue for their fights to attract publicity and earn status among their peers.

Similar scenes occur in most countries these days.

Even KG & Corney admitted that the recent 'disturbances' outside Hindmarsh were caused by people who were outside the stadium long before the crowd came out.

BAGGIO 15 · Post by **BAGGIO 15** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:42 pm

The problem is well acknowledged, but the question is how to prevent these people from hijacking the sport.

Wild Eagle · Post by **Wild Eagle** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 6:32 pm

Fred Goldstone wrote:Time for FIFA to step in and ban all Italian teams from International competitions for five years.

They did it to England and it worked pretty well.

There is nowhere near the amount of violence in the UK now compared to Italy, Holland and France.

The problem is that FIFA is too gutless to act against Italy because they have a lot of influence on the various boards.

UEFA has the ruling over club teams, just as it did when it banned English teams, not FIFA.

I agree with you with the exception of less violence in English football: they simply stopped reporting it, it still happens every week.

I hope you realise that if football stops in Italy it will be the time everyone kills everyone else; a political situation of great magnitude, not gutlessness (by UEFA, not FIFA - unless they ban the National side)

The one and only · Post by **The one and only** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 6:36 pm

maybe they should ban all italian teams from european competitions for a year maybe

it wouldn't be as drastic as the 5 year ban the england teams got but it might teach them something

mooroffside · Post by **mooroffside** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:46 pm

I think you will find most English grounds are trouble free.

This is a link to the English FA website.

http://www.thefa.com/TheFA/NewsFromTheF ... tsFall.htm

If you read the previous 2004 report, it quotes the attendances as being 29 million. So under 4000 arrests out of 29 million isn't a large amount.

They FA produce tables for all league clubs at the end of the season, and they are held acountable by the FA if the figure is to high. Fines and sanctions maybe imposed.

You hardly see police men inside the ground,nowadays, they tend to patrol in the local vicinity, pubs and town centres. The number of police is dependant on what team is visiting. The police have a large amount of intel on the fans of each club, and are usually prepared.

Here is another link to a report by the BBC in 2001 and the measures taken to combat the "English Disease"

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1491743.stm

From personal experience, watching football now in England is a family experience. Unlike the battlefields both inside and outside of the ground in the 1970's and 80's. They were scary times, and not anything any true true football fan should have to endure.

Fred Goldstone · Post by **Fred Goldstone** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:52 am

Actually, UEFA were ordered by the FIFA exucutive committee to take strong action against English clubs or UEFA itself would be banned from all FIFA controlled competitions.

UEFA only administer competitions under licence from FIFA.

England's only crime was that it failed to control it's 'fans' violence at senior (professional) level matches.

Italy ( and therefore UEFA ) has failed to act on effectively on widespread corruption at all levels of their game and has also failed to act on widespread violence at all levels of their game, so it is up to FIFA to intervene.

Knight7 · Post by **Knight7** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:58 am

Wild Eagle wrote:
Fred Goldstone wrote:Time for FIFA to step in and ban all Italian teams from International competitions for five years.

They did it to England and it worked pretty well.

There is nowhere near the amount of violence in the UK now compared to Italy, Holland and France.

The problem is that FIFA is too gutless to act against Italy because they have a lot of influence on the various boards.

UEFA has the ruling over club teams, just as it did when it banned English teams, not FIFA.

I agree with you with the exception of less violence in English football: they simply stopped reporting it, it still happens every week.

I hope you realise that if football stops in Italy it will be the time everyone kills everyone else; a political situation of great magnitude, not gutlessness (by UEFA, not FIFA - unless they ban the National side)

The Premier League matches are much much safer very few incidents - not sure about the lower leagues but you can feel safe at a Premier League match these days

getborn · Post by **getborn** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 11:03 am

Fred Goldstone wrote:Time for FIFA to step in and ban all Italian teams from International competitions for five years.

They did it to England and it worked pretty well.

There is nowhere near the amount of violence in the UK now compared to Italy, Holland and France.

The problem is that FIFA is too gutless to act against Italy because they have a lot of influence on the various boards.

do you actually know what youre talking about

psg fans have started nothing short of a war in paris, a supporter was recently shot dead by police

can you name one italian on these "various boards" you speak of

getborn · Post by **getborn** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 11:07 am

BAGGIO 15 wrote:
Fred Goldstone wrote:Yes there is a difference English fans are kless of a problem, Italian fans have got worse.
The Juventus fans were hardly innocent at Heysel they just got the cabernet kicked out of them by a larger and even more vicious mob.
I use the event as a whole, as an example, not laying blame.
Italian violence has risen, just don't want others to think the problem no longer exists in the UK. It's a football issue that needs cleaning up world wide, just more intensly in some countries.

it does

it is a global problem belonging to the sport not just to individual clubs or countries.

Wild Eagle · Post by **Wild Eagle** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 12:47 pm

Fred Goldstone wrote:Actually, UEFA were ordered by the FIFA exucutive committee to take strong action against English clubs or UEFA itself would be banned from all FIFA controlled competitions.

UEFA only administer competitions under licence from FIFA.

England's only crime was that it failed to control it's 'fans' violence at senior (professional) level matches.

Italy ( and therefore UEFA ) has failed to act on effectively on widespread corruption at all levels of their game and has also failed to act on widespread violence at all levels of their game, so it is up to FIFA to intervene.

Ok, Mr Goldstone, point by point reply:

I doubt FIFA instigated the ban but if you can back your claim with any evidence I will gladly admit I am wrong and thank you for educating me on this subject.

FIFA has no licence over the Champion's League that I know of; might you be talking of 'endorsement'? I am not sure, so again if you know let me know.

England's only crime was that it failed to control it's 'fans' violence at senior (professional) level matches?

Don't be outrageous! Travelling club and National fans were disseminating widespread terror in the 70s and early 80s...minimising this detracts from your obvious intelligence.

Italy's corruption has been proven at club level, which is not 'all levels', dear Sir!

I honestly do not remember fans of the National side acting violently of late.
If you do, please put me straight.

Again, violence and corruption are proven at club level, so please contain yourself when speaking of the World Champions or make pointed accusations that substantiate your argument.

FIFA intervenes in cases such as government interference, such as Iran's one that keeps sacking and appointing as they please without leaving the agreed upon autonomy which football federations wolrdwide should enjoy....

and THAT is when FIFA intervenes, thank you.

Other thing, this is more a problem to be dealt with by Italian justice (notice the irony) than Sporting Administration.

Insofar, nobody even knows how exactly the policeman died so it's a complex police case.

Also, I have always stated and always will that Heysel is blood on the hands of UEFA and the Belgian authorities...had it been a safe venue it would just have been an 'all in brawl'
[/quote][/b]

The one and only · Post by **The one and only** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 1:14 pm

why dont they just make catania and if they have to palermo play behind closed doors for a certain amount of time

Juventino · Post by **Juventino** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 1:17 pm

Catania have already had a two match stadium ban earlier this season - hasn't worked.

The one and only · Post by **The one and only** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 1:24 pm

juventino_4_ever wrote:Catania have already had a two match stadium ban earlier this season - hasn't worked.

they should make em do it for the rest of the year

aussie_ascoli · Post by **aussie_ascoli** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 1:53 pm

I'm of the point of view to Null this season and start again next season.

These are my reasons why re-starting the comp now, will be a bad thing.

Why should the clubs pay for everything when 1. They don't own the stadiums, 2. Small clubs have no money.
The polititians and authorities say, we put laws here, and there, but the clubs are not following it. Why blame the clubs when they get no support????

I'll use this example, it may not be the right one but you should get my point - Its like saying, we need to stop speeding drivers, and that the police need to catch more people. One step that the government implement a law that is that every police officer must carry a speed gun (i assume they don't), and other devices, however no funding will be given by the government. Then if this problem continually occurs, the government comes out and blames the police for not implementing more speed guns and the other devices.

We must look on who benefits from contiuning the competetion now.
1. Small clubs lose their 12th man effect.
2. If small clubs play infront of no-one, they get no revenue.
3. Big clubs don't lose money from TV rights, however small clubs literally gets nothing from TV rights.
4. Small clubs cannot afford to fix their stadiums, and if they are forced to pay for stadium, it may send clubs broke.

Big clubs don't lose much out of this, however small clubs get a massive nail driven into their coffin.

The already MASSIVE gap is getting bigger and bigger.

Honestly, i believe null this season then re-start the comp next season is the best option for everyone. I don't want to see great small clubs playing in C2, D, Eccelenza, etc, Cause their sent broke by this.

Fred Goldstone · Post by **Fred Goldstone** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 1:56 pm

Wild Eagle, FIFA is the the RULING body of Football and as such has jurisdiction over every level of the sport from the world cup to amateurs and juniors.

UEFA is just a regional body charged with looking after the day-to-day affairs of it's region and running the various international competitions on behalf of it's member countries.

FIFA has the power to veto any decision by UEFA and to intervene in any dispute at it's discretion.

England was rightly punished for the actions of it's 'supporters' in the past but since then UEFA & FIFA have failed to act effectively against other countries.

'Supporters' in Holland, France & Italy have created far more trouble over the last ten years than any English fans, yet there has not been any attempt by UEFA to force their ruling bodies to clean up their act.

The widespread corruption in Italian football has been pr5oven to extend from the top to the bottom of the organisation but again UEFA has failed to act.
This is despite clubs involved in UEFA competitions being found guily of bribes and corruption that enabled them to win entry to UEFA competitions!!!!!!!!!

LFTWNG11 · Post by **LFTWNG11** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 2:33 pm

Fred Goldstone wrote:Wild Eagle, FIFA is the the RULING body of Football and as such has jurisdiction over every level of the sport from the world cup to amateurs and juniors.

UEFA is just a regional body charged with looking after the day-to-day affairs of it's region and running the various international competitions on behalf of it's member countries.

FIFA has the power to veto any decision by UEFA and to intervene in any dispute at it's discretion.

England was rightly punished for the actions of it's 'supporters' in the past but since then UEFA & FIFA have failed to act effectively against other countries.

'Supporters' in Holland, France & Italy have created far more trouble over the last ten years than any English fans, yet there has not been any attempt by UEFA to force their ruling bodies to clean up their act.

The widespread corruption in Italian football has been pr5oven to extend from the top to the bottom of the organisation but again UEFA has failed to act.
This is despite clubs involved in UEFA competitions being found guily of bribes and corruption that enabled them to win entry to UEFA competitions!!!!!!!!!

ahhh I think you will find, while FIFA has authority to veto and step in, they usually dont as the poeple who run UEFA, I would say are good enough to run their organisation as it deems fit.

Its easy for you to say that the England game has been cleaned up, but in reality it hasn't, just because English hooligans go out on backstreets and away from prying eyes to fight, cause havoc and the like doesn't mean it doesn't happen although countries England have done very well to keep it out of stadiums over the past decade, its obivous countries like Italy have to catch up to this point at least!

And I would love to see your proof that the Italian game is corrupt at all levels. Did Italy buy the world cup did they?? Do Italian clubs get preference over other clubs in UEFA competitions do they?? Proof would be handy in you accusations, but lets not let the truth get in the way of a good story, I mean the four clubs who were corrupt make up the majority of the hundreds of professional clubs in Italy right?? Even then these clubs weren't prosceuted with hard evidence, only circumstantial. In compairson to the EPL, which is an ethical haven for football right?? Nothing wrong with a transfer bung here and there.

Keep up the pro-English, anti-Italian posts coming, they are hilarious!

The Kop · Post by **The Kop** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 3:02 pm

FIFA has no power over UEFA. FIFA is not a parental body of UEFA both operate independently.

If it wasnt for the World Cups, FIFA would be toothless.
The only thing FIFA can do is apply pressure with regards to distribution of WC revenue and suspend nations from their competitions.

The one and only · Post by **The one and only** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 3:43 pm

so why dont they suspend them from some sort of competition then

BAGGIO 15 · Post by **BAGGIO 15** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 4:26 pm

The one and only wrote:so why dont they suspend them from some sort of competition then

For what, a Leeds fan was killed in Turkey some years back, Turkey weren't kick out. People sadly die all over the world at football matches. There are afew examples of this each season from a terrace falling, a ballist raid, someone getting trodden on and yes in fights between supporters. Its sad, but it happens and I wish it didn't, but why would UEFA or FIFA get involved in domestic incident. Hysel was a comp run by UEFA, thats why they sanctioned the English, if 1 person had of passed there may of not been a sanction so serious impossed, it was due to the massive numbers.

Le King · Post by **Le King** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 6:39 pm

take bak the wc or ban italy from the nxt 2 world cups...
gotta go stir the soup ;)

BAGGIO 15 · Post by **BAGGIO 15** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:09 pm

MUFCBOY wrote:take bak the wc or ban italy from the nxt 2 world cups...
gotta go stir the soup ;)

Feel free.

Le King · Post by **Le King** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:11 pm

jst takin the piss son

BAGGIO 15 · Post by **BAGGIO 15** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 8:27 pm

MUFCBOY wrote:jst takin the piss son

ALL good.

vigilante · Post by **vigilante** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:29 pm

I think they should halt this season have a good clean out then start again, with serious penalties for repeat offenders. Introduce a salary cap and away we go. One added bonus would be that Juventus will get to spend another season in serie b.

sorry baggio couldn't help myself

Seriously it would take generations to stop the provincial/regional hatered that has existed in italy for centuries, however they've got to start somewhere. Now is a good a time as any.

BAGGIO 15 · Post by **BAGGIO 15** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:33 pm

Read a season with Verona by Tim Parks.
Tells a great tail about the author going to every game for the season and about the road trips ect. Goes into detail about regional rivalries. A great read.